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Ok. I will start upfront with a Split in things.
Guild Wars.
Guild Rank. 
Those won't and should not be the same.
There's a difference between GuildWars and ZoneGuildWars.

Once Guilds get actual features,  Multi Guilding should absolutely not be allowed.
Gaining multiple benefits by being in multiple guilds is the same as applying to daily rewards with several accounts or doing boss on several accounts.
Yes, guilds are for fun, but if you just seek the fun, there's no need to be in the Competetive aspect of the game, therefore if you just want to chat with people, use global or PMs, or create an own guild with those people.
But first and foremost guilds are a competitive thing.

Another thing is, when you are in a guild, you should still be able to see the guild list. 
Guilds should have their own site visitable where they can write a description, implement a guild "avatar" etc, basically a profile page for guilds, able to be seen by every player. 

So, let's start with Guild rank. 

Guild Rank needs to be PvE.
Guild rank should use the member count in the same way as different pokemon score.
It needs to be a factor.
So, guild rank should be all the relevant ranking aspects of ALL members / the amount.
So let's say we got 5 members.
1 with 1.000.000 overall exp
The second with  2.000.000
Third with  3.000.000
Fourth  with 4.000.000 
Fifth with  5.000.000 
1.000.000+2.000.000+300.000.000+4.000.00+5.000.000 = 15.000.000.
But it's 5 members, so we need to divide by member count.
So 15.000.000 / 5 = 3.000.000.
That would be the Guilds Exp ranking factor.
That factor however should be multiplicated with the factor for guild members.
A smaller guild shouldn't outdo a bigger guild only cause their average outcome is higher. 
Of course we could also simply add it, but that would allow a member spam to kill of the quality aspect of it.
So all in all, we could transfer the current Player Ranking system with only slight adjustments.
(The actual unfiltered exp should be viewable on the Guild Page in this case the 15.000.000, not just the 3.000.000)

To separate Player and Guild ranking, I'd suggest adding a Guild Storage. 
Now the clue, you can donate from it, and leader, co-leader, storagemaster  (new role) can release from that storage, but you cannot take it out anymore. 

So what we're achieving? Basically a ranking profile similar to that of players for a guild.
E.g. The Storage will be counted regularly. 
Dps is Dps
Avg lvl is avg lvl etc.

The Storage should be depleted every set time. 
So whatever gets donated in there is basically lost. 

Why should that be good? Well, it prevents old player guilds to dominate every other guild forever, it gives more reason to hunting again etc.

So you're hunting... you're finding a trash shiny.... now you'd have the question : Do i sell it, do i keep it for my ranking,  or do i donate it to the guild so to increase guild ranking and therefore partly benefitting everyone etc.

Of course if your guild doesn't care about Ranking and related benefits, you don't need to do it.

The question remaining, should the guildbank be an element for that aswell?
E.g. donating gold for events and rank but it also gets depleted same way?
Should there be s secondary bank for the ranking that gets depleted and the main bank remain unaffected? 
That's on you to decide and discuss. 


Soohooo wait! 
Elo is part of the Rank isn't it?
And I say keep it. 
So we got a guild with X Players?  Then we do it as following :

Let's say X is 5 in this case.

Every player in a guild can ELO battle against another guild.
The Defending Guild will have a Pool.
The pool is every member.
So in this case,  the defending guild's Pool is 5.
Out of that Pool, a member of the guild is randomly selected.

It's the same as regular ELO except that the Guild ELO Pool is limited to the guild's members.

The likelihood of an ELO pick from the pool can vary. 
Let's say with Each defeat of team x, that team's likelihood to get randomly picked is reduced by x%.
So in against a guild with 5 members, the likelihood of a team to come up is 20%.
Let's say it get's reduced by 8% per loss.
Then the next pick it's only 12% and the likeliness for the remaining teams is 22%.
Whether a team which often wins is to be boosted in likelihood or not, is something i won't decide on.

If there should occur problems with too many people elo'ing at the same time, I'd say implement a Role in the guild.
Example implement the Role "ELOer".
There can only be X ELOers per guild, and only those are able to do guild ELO battles.
However, still every member is able to be fought against. 

That way, competition will brew up. If a guild decides to down the rank of the highest ELO guild, they'd gain points and get into crossfire of other guilds etc.
So there should be a constant skirmish of Guild ELO if we allow specific guilds to be elo'ed.

That takes care of there still being deficits and benefits alike to Guilds with requirements. 

As for Guild Wars. 
It's absolutely crucial and a definite necessacity, that they are live PvP.

For that I'd suggest 

1. Bigger Guild being limited to smaller guilds number. 
Example a Guild of 20 battling a guild of 5 means the bigger guild needs to decide on 5.
2. Live PvP, beginning based on server time.
3. Forced match entry.

So the bigger guild challenges the smaller.
That requires a system. 
1. An official time needs to be set.
2. Members need to officially be set.
3. You need to be brought into the PvP screen.

Let's say the matchups are random.

Both guilds placed 5 members each 

Both guilds set server time 7PM.

Then once the server time hits 7 PM.
The matchups will be drawn randomly 
And the players will enter the PvP screen as if they'd agreed to a PvP invite.
The number of overall wins decide the winner.
If out of those 5 matches one guild wins 3, that guild won.

IMPORTANT : This is absolutely not like ELO, so there is  a possibility of implementing it, it won't require thousands of players to be online, it only requires x players to be online and that at a given time.

If one fails to be online at that time, it'll be the regular auto move selection and loss after 5 in a row.

Now this is just the basic system, that can be used for fun, or maybe for a little  reward, but more to that later. 

Guild Bank.
The guild bank will be a bank where you store the money of the guild  (this will be crucial)
Maybe implement  a 1 / 50 factor for that bank (we can compensate for that with either adjusting transaction  [placing in and taking out] or by adjusting prices for what to do with guild bank).
There should be only 3 People able to take money from it.
But everybody is able to pay in (Record table to see who donated how much )
The 3 People all owed should be : Leader. CO-Leader. And however you wanna name it, GuildBankier, Treasuremaster etc.

Now off to the Rewards.

The Guild's ranking place shouldn't reward anything. 
Scoring Rank 1 in a ranking respective factor e.g. Overall Exp rewards a set benefit.
That could be something like  15m per week to the guild bank.
So a guild being rank 1 in every area gets the most. 

There can still be rewards for rank 2 and 3 in the areas.

Rank 1 can still reward a little something. 

Now, why no general Top X rewards? 
I think it kills the Guild system..
For if there's a Top X, it could lead to there just remaining X guilds as well. 
If there's a Top 10, people might fuse guilds till there's just 10 left to gain the benefit without any investment. 

Guild Wars could be something like a guild enters a set amount of gold from the Guild Bank (both participating guilds)
The winner takes all.
So if both put 15m each,  the winner gets 30m.
Otherwise it could just be for fun.

Now the Zone Ownerships are to be decided by a big Guild Wars.
My original idea of making it like the Daily Rewards is still an idea, but i believe another method to be better.

It's one grand tourney.
Now, this will be the most complex implementation I'd assume. 

First of all, it should be a regular progression tournament. 
E.g. 16 - 8 - 4 -2 -1 
The Guilds all apply for it.
Won't start until a needed number of participants is met.
E.g  16.
12 won't work since  12 - 6 -3 ... scripting a 3 ffa most overall wins win would be too much work i guess.
For this Guild Wars,  a needed number of Members is required. 
Let's say 10.
That way the uber mega quality guilds won't have an unfair gain for that. Guild growth should be a crucial point.

So to draw a short summary : Guild Wars, Elimination Tournament, Gold needed to apply, x member count needed to apply. 

Upfront a certain number of Players is required. So that the matchups just likeregular guild wars can be set.
E.g. EVERY guild in zone wars has to send in 5 players. 

SIDENOTE : once game is more active, we can limit every player to only one participation throughout zone guild wars.

So for every matchup, you pick a new 5 members you want to send it.

So it's like regular Guild Wars, but with a kind of repetition in between. 
Guild X vs Guild Y both send in 5 members. Guild X wins.
Guild X to next turn against Guild Z.
Both select 5 members again. 
Now the thing is,
The guild winning the Tournament wins the first pick. 
Let's say guild  X was first, Y was second and Z was third 
Then X chooses first, let's say Zone 19.
Then Y picks a zone to their liking, let's say Zone 17.
Then Z picks one, let's say 12.

If there were enough participants, the outcome should be a relatively evenly split of zone ownerships.
Of course, with 16 participants, 3 zones are left, that means a bonus zone for the first 3.
And personally, i feel like that should be the case no matter what,  even if there were 32 participants, only the first 16 should get a zone.

Otherwise the Daily Reward  Like System is an option.
That means a tournament for every Zone individually. 
They too would be time based.
And the need to be won every.. idk 6 months?
So you could split it that every week there's the war for one zone.
That however somewhat enables one guild to win several ownerships.

The system and requirements would be the same.
This way however, better zones would require more.
E.g. zone 1 1.000.000 gold and 10 members to enter. 
Zone 19. 100.000.000 gold and 100 members to enter. 

The tricky part is, setting times for these guild wars.
They'd need to be officially set by the server...
So it should be on Weekends, during afternoon to evening.
That way one tourney could last from Friday to Sunday depending on the amount of general rounds.
Since the Guild got the option to place their members for each new round, there won't be a problem with timezones..
If it's too late for you to enter, don't get yourself applied etc.

The zone rewards allow smaller guilds to also benefit, and Give PvP focused guilds to get great benefits aswell, even  when they are not in a top tier PvE+PvP guild.

So let me summarize this Thread. 

- New Guild Roles.

-A PvE Ranking 
Includes ELO
Bigger Guilds benefit, but quality is required. 
Also gives rewards. 

-PvE Ranking rewards, not dependant on being Top X but decided by being Rank 1-x in a ranking factor. 

-A Guild Wars feature.
NOT LIKE ELO, not ranking relevant. 
Live PvP, set participant count
May allow Gold gain. 

-A Zone Guild Wars Tournament Feature. 
Live PvP
Elimination Tournament 
Awards Ownerships of zones
Happens every X time
Has requirements to participate 
Should be on Weekend

-Guild Bank Feature 
Members can donate money
Guild Leader, Co-Leader and new role can take money from it
Basis for all big Guild Events 

This is the idea, people.
Discuss, voice concern, deepen the features etc.

P.s.: I'd like to suggest a Guild Raid feature for somewhere in the future.
It should be a monstrous buffed boss.
Every member from the Guild gets to fight it, possibly in a row, once one ks defeated, progress is safed and next member enters the battle to continue etc.
Should also require a certain gold amount to enter, and should award loads of gold to the guild bank.
That allows the money to be split or given to the users so that they can improve their stuff or kept on the bank to use for the Events. 

P.p.s.: I'm incredibly tired but had the urge to get that onto paper, forgive some hard to read phrasing and typos please :3.

M30 - Galliant
I read the title so sounds good
[Image: tyranitar_in_dragon_form_by_black_wing24-d47c29u.jpg]

Beat me? Ha, when Tyranitars fly...

Ok I read it and support everything in it except the ownership of zones. if the benefit to owning the zones is ex/ gold benefits i think the game is easy enough and adding rewards for being a part of these guilds owning a zone is more nerfing
[Image: tyranitar_in_dragon_form_by_black_wing24-d47c29u.jpg]

Beat me? Ha, when Tyranitars fly...

honestly great thread blau well made and would be great if cef will do it like this even tho might take some time to finish but all in all it sounds great and workable
another good idea :p
always support all idea about pvp in guild wars~
Finally someone took the time to go indepth and give new ideas, r8 8/8 m8, gr8 Big Grin
Some Day You'll Leave This World Behind,
So Live a Life You Will Remember
-Avicii: The Nights
come on guyz we need more comments post your views

show some interest towards game  Big Grin
I really like the idea of all this. Will definitely make the game a lot betterSmile
Finally gathered the power to read this so long thread 

1. on guild rank . it should be avg total exp as said 

2 "  So, guild rank should be all the relevant ranking aspects of ALL members / the amount. " 

shoudnt it be the amount / all members instead ? as i say the example of 15b texp / 5 

3. what is factor for guild member ? is the total no. of members ? 

but main question why cant gw decide guild rank instead . its fair thats  in x vs x. no unfair advantage . thats where strong guild thing is shown

depleting thing should be there as per your  2nd option. i do agree  without that it gives unfair advantage to old IF THAT IS COMING but then a normal guild rank shouldnt be based on that factor 

for guild bank yea we should have something like that why not but again shouldnt get depleted

so for me i dont think 2nd option is good 

1st still somewhat better but more criteria needs to be added into it 


how is 5 v5 done ? its computer based how is the 5 selected from a guild  that is gonna defend  from the other guild ? 
making pool adding that in system so only those 5 of a guild wit another guild 5 
or it can be some title assigned by leader to 5. compute r chooses the pool 
its too complex imo 

other then that idea looks fine 
but then differentiating eloing for guilding and eloing for personal has to be defined 

so in short i like the idea but got complications 


"Bigger Guild being limited to smaller guilds number. "
should be a minimum number of smaller guild too to quality in gw say 10 

cant be if smaller guild is 1 man, bigger guild has to send 1 . so 1 vs 1 decide it
if it is that way i am happy being alone :p 

2nd server time it would be complicated if mutually guild decide time i mean hard to get a mutual consent.
Reason - both team wants there best 5 in this case to be available 

all 5 might be available for guild x at 7 pm. but only  4 are available of guild y . 

now guild y would say 9pm since all 5 available but then guild x got only  3 of the best

this way if both guilds wants tehre best 5 its hard to setp time 

best is official time being set.
after random matchups are made 1 day is given for guild to talk to there members and fix time per match 

playerx of guild x  vs player y of guildy  at 8pm 

player z of guild   vs player q of guildy at 9m etc

getting mutual consent of 2 players is better then mutual consents of 2 guild as i said both guild would want all 5 avaiable 

rest yea forced battle official fix time


whats 1/50 factor? 
i would say leader should be able  promote players so he can make 2-3 treasurer etc as he wants , 2 or 3 co leaders etc . and only those can withdraw 

TBC Tomorrow

not much 
jsut guild wars should also have rankings .
like pve rankings there, a pvp rankings should also be there
so guild winning gw should get rank 1 in pvp gw etc

for zone owner 1 should should be able to claim 2or 3 or 4 zones etc 
that should be benefit of being a strong i believe should be given
all participatory guilds if say 16 should be getting reward just like this 

or we can set top 10 guilds get ownership 

top 1 gets 5 zones of there choice
rank 2 gets 4 of choice
rank 3 gets 3 of choice 

other 7 gets 1 each somewhat of choice in order of 4-> 10
Nice post
Thank you so much. Your information is so clear and helpful.
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I really like the idea of all this. Will definitely make the game a lot betterSmile

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